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Welcome and Introductions
Stephanie: Hello, everyone. Welcome or welcome back to the Filthy Rich Cleaners podcast. I am your host, Stephanie, from Serene Clean. In today’s special in-person episode, I’m here with my work bestie, Nicole, who is a content manager at ZenMaid. ZenMaid is the place to be. We are here — we just wrapped up CleanCon here in fabulous Indianapolis, and we wanted to do a quick little episode.
Table of contents
The thing that I really want to talk to Nicole about today is making content — making content for your cleaning businesses, Nicole’s experience in her role at ZenMaid, and what has really resonated with you guys as an audience, perhaps some surprising things. And just the role of authenticity in your content and truly being yourself. We had a lot of conversations the past couple of days with owners about content, and it was really eye-opening and also validating that we’re on the right path. So, Nicole, give us a little of your background, a little rundown.
Nicole: I’m Nicole. I’m on the ZenMaid team full time. I’m a content marketing manager, and I came from my last job, which was also in tech. I was working at a B2B SaaS company — very traditional, a business selling software to other businesses. I came to ZenMaid because I was looking for new roles and I just felt it’s a very authentic brand, which I loved. Making content and marketing is so much easier when you’re doing it for an audience that is relatable to you. In my previous roles, when you’re selling software to a very specific business unit — software engineers or product managers — I just couldn’t relate to them. I’m not a cleaning business owner, but it’s just so much easier to make content that’s relatable and connectable. And we can have so much fun with it, because ZenMaid is a very playful brand.
I feel like that’s the direction we’ve gotten in the past couple of years, but especially this year, where we’re just like — there’s no bullshit. We’re going to be talking to people about real life, not masking content and pretending that everything is sunshine and rainbows all the time. It’s just not real life, because you go through a lot of stuff.
Stephanie: Owners do. And you guys may have seen Nicole’s TikToks — they were fantastic. We collaborate a lot on those where she’s like, “All right, this is the trend — what do we do for a caption that’s actually going to connect to cleaning business?” And sometimes they’re so hyper-specific.
Nicole: I’ll ask Stephanie and I’ll ask Maria on our team, who also owns a cleaning business. I’ll just say, “Here’s a sound. I think this is so funny — but what is a very specific scenario?” And you guys are always like, “Oh my god, I can name fifty.” So it’s always so fun.
My background — I’ve been out of school for five years. I went to school at Boston University for marketing and general Business Information Systems. I had a very entry-level, corporate, buttoned-up type of job my first year out of college. Then I was like, I need to move into tech, because tech is so much more my speed. Things move fast, you iterate quickly, and the red tape at larger organizations was just not for me. If we have an idea, sometimes we just roll with it. Sometimes I’m like, “I’m posting it,” and Amar is like, “Okay, go ahead.” Sometimes I feel like I’m slowing people down by asking for approval.
Stephanie: I feel like Amar, our CEO, and just the culture there is more like, if you have the hunch and gut feeling that this is going to resonate, just do it. And I think that’s a really good lesson for cleaning business owners. We’re small businesses — I think we overthink it. “Is this thing perfect? It needs to be absolutely flawless before we post it or put this out to our team or our staff.” And I think it really is the imperfections that make it feel real, because none of us are perfect. You guys see the blooper reels of me — they love making the blooper reels of me. We have so much good content behind the scenes that we cannot air. Some things cannot be publicized, but we will laugh internally.
The Power of Imperfection in Content
Stephanie: The point is, whatever you are afraid of because it’s not perfect — that’s actually what you should post. That was something somebody said on one of the panels at this CleanCon. They were having their team get on camera, trying to do team interviews for content on their website. Everybody — they’re not paid actors — so what they did instead was make a blooper reel. They posted the blooper reel and customers loved it, because it’s like, “Oh my gosh, look at your happy cleaners — these are them being real.” That’s what people want to see so that they can trust you.
After CleanCon yesterday, we were out in downtown Indianapolis with some owners and other people in the industry. One of them was talking to me specifically over drinks, and he was like, “I made one video.” Of all the other videos he’d made that were very professional and buttoned up to promote his commercial cleaning business, he filmed this one not expecting it to do anything. He was wearing some type of punk or emo band t-shirt and just posted it. He got thousands of views and got clients from that video because people were like, “I liked your business, but I liked your shirt. You seem cool.” He said that was accidentally the most important thing he did — showcase a little bit of himself — and it got him lots of recurring clients that he still works with to this day. All because of a t-shirt.
So it’s really about leaning into who you are. It’s very outdated to think that everything has to appear perfect. It does take some nuance — I’m not going to lie — of what you show your customers versus the content we make for ZenMaid. I don’t necessarily want my cleaning business clients to see our content. If they stumble upon it, it wouldn’t be the worst thing, but it’s a different audience. I’m very unfiltered here — I wouldn’t cuss to a client. But I think at this point I have the brand built up enough that it wouldn’t hurt me. It is something to consider.
Nicole: For the stuff we make on ZenMaid, usually we’re talking about crummy situations. You’re going to have days where everything is going wrong, and sometimes it does have to do with the client or people you’re working with. That’s relatable to you guys, so we post about it and talk about it. It’s super fun. It wouldn’t be the end of the world if clients saw that and were like, “Oh look, they’re complaining about this email that I sent them.” But you also would not post a video making fun of the frustrations that a specific client caused.
Stephanie: For me, everything I put out into the world, I ask: if a client does see this, will I stand behind it and say, “Yeah, that happened and this is how we handled it”? Even some of the bad things — I’ve thought about documenting some of the bad things that happen in the business where we mess up. But because we’re being transparent that nobody’s perfect and we’re trying to handle it with integrity — one of our core values — if a client did see that, it’s like, “Oh yeah, they’re real people. Mistakes happen, but they deal with it the way they need to.”
Content Strategy for Your Cleaning Business
Stephanie: When it comes to what our listeners can take away for their own cleaning businesses — we make a lot of content that is supposed to be relatable to the struggle. That is one of the pieces of advice I would give you guys: if you can make content for your clients or prospective clients about the struggles that you know they face, and relate to them about that, make them not feel so alone. It’s the same concept of what we’re doing here. Cleaning business owners, you need to do that for your clients — “I understand your struggles. I know your pain, and I’m going to solve it.”
Nicole: I would recommend for cleaning business owners — or even just small business owners — think about your own content consumption habits. I love Instagram and TikTok. I send stuff to my friends, my mom, we share things back and forth. When I’m thinking about how I’m influenced to purchase a service or choose a service provider for anything — cleaning, dog walking, whatever — I think about what makes me trust that brand. That stuff is really important, and sometimes it’s hard to think about it that way when you’re zoned in working on content. For ZenMaid that’s email, social, community, video — I literally edit the podcast, so it’s going to be really weird that I’m editing myself.
Stephanie: So bad. It is so stupid. And like, Inception podcast — it’s so strange.
Nicole: But it’s just very hard sometimes when I’m diving so deep to be like, “Okay, but what would someone watching this content, or even just reading stuff that we’re putting out, think about it?” And for me now, the AI slop is so prevalent. It’s just frustrating sometimes when you’re scrolling and you can tell in 0.2 seconds that it’s ChatGPT. It’s a really good tool, but some people who don’t have time to post their own stuff are over-indexing on it, and now our brains are being trained to gloss over that when scrolling. It’s great to use it as a tool or for inspiration, but take the extra couple of minutes to put it in your own voice. I know that now I wouldn’t trust a brand where I’m like, “Okay, they don’t have a thought behind this piece — they’re literally just putting it in.”
Stephanie: And there were some extra fingers in AI-generated pictures — we may have seen that at some point this weekend. Take the extra time and don’t just rely on AI so much. Obviously, I’m a huge fan of AI and what it’s done for my business — it’s amazing. It’s something I’m definitely noting and being aware of now. I’ve passed off a lot of our content posting to my executive assistant, and I can see that in our captions. It’s something I want to correct, because you can even tell — the em dashes, the sentence structure, the way things are phrased. It’s telltale. Words like “quietly” or “silently” — ChatGPT uses those all the time. Or phrases like “not hustle, just commitment” — you wouldn’t really use that in everyday speech.
Nicole: As a content person, people hire me because they want a human to be relatable and touching all these different pieces of content — video, social, whatever. It’s really important to have a human touch nowadays. Don’t over-index on AI.
And also, client testimonials — I am absolutely influenced by influencers. If I see someone I relate to and they’re like, “I love this brand,” I’m going to go with that recommendation. I was looking at bed sheets and I trust this person on their Instagram — even if it’s a sponsored post, I trust her for what bed sheets to buy, or this luxury silk option. “Okay, this sounds good.”
Getting on Video and Building Trust
[ZenMaid Ad]
Stephanie: People trust people they can relate to. If they like you because of your content, that matters. It’s not the first and will not be the last time I tell you guys — you need to get on video. You have to, no matter how hard it is for you. I know you don’t want to be the face of the company. I know you feel awkward. But going back to Drew Larrison’s episode, we talked about just practicing getting on camera and getting used to it, because your customers are going to relate to you so much more and trust you more when they can see you. Think about why you care so much about this and how you can solve their problems.
One of the other things mentioned in the sessions at CleanCon was: geared toward selling. We certainly don’t do that at ZenMaid — at some point that’s a turn-off. When I’m consuming media or reading emails, I’m just like, “Leave me alone. I don’t need to hear for the fiftieth time why I should buy your thing.” But if you provide value, then you have that positive brand affiliation. When someone’s ready — maybe they’re not ready to have a cleaner right now — but they’re going to think of you when they are. It’s very easy to underestimate how powerful that actually is.
Nicole: We hear that a lot with ZenMaid specifically — people are like, “I’m on your email newsletter, I’ve seen all these things,” but they weren’t ready to either make the switch or they were just figuring out their back-end operations. And suddenly they’re like, “I’ve seen your name enough times. I know ZenMaid is a scheduler I could use.” It’s super meta, but you guys are literally consuming this podcast. You could not be a ZenMaid customer — that’s not the goal. But the point is, you’re aware of ZenMaid because you’re consuming our educational content. We’re not trying to sell to you right now. We’re just talking.
Think about that in your own cleaning business — what could you put out there that’s not super directly selling? It’s about awareness and creating content at every layer of the funnel. People need to be aware of you. It doesn’t mean they’re going to buy from you the second they see your first post. They may have to see you a hundred times before they’re ready to make that purchasing decision. You don’t know where the person watching is at, but they need to be aware of you.
My neighbor in Boston owns a yoga studio. She was a teacher for many years, in her fifties, and decided she wanted to open a yoga studio. I’ve been helping her with her social media. She just moved location — about a mile down the road — so it’s a new neighborhood. In doing her social media, we realized: every video doesn’t have to be “Buy a class pack. This is our price.” We just want people to know it’s there. “Oh, this is new to the neighborhood — that’s really cool, check it out.” Your goal with posting on social media or on your website is not that every single post has to make someone book immediately. That’s not authentic.
Your Story Is Your Brand
Nicole: When you were talking about showing who you are — I always look up people’s websites when I’m meeting them because I’m curious what their brand looks like and where they operate from. A lot of them don’t have About Us sections. Maybe I’m biased, but I love reading someone’s story about why they started their business or what their background is. A lot of people tend to be pretty bashful about putting their face on the company. On Facebook, sometimes I’ll find people who are so cool and lively and communicative — talking about their clients and all their success stories — and then you go to their website and you have no idea. It makes me feel like I’m looking at a commoditized service. It’s very impersonal.
Stephanie: Standing out from the actual service perspective is difficult. We’re all cleaning houses — it’s not revolutionary. So we have to stand out some other way. The best way is making your story very prevalent and a part of your brand. How many guests have we had on where they’re telling their story and I’m like, “Can I buy anything from you? You’re so inspirational.” Every single one of you listening right now has a unique story of why you opened this business. We want to hear it as consumers. You have something valuable to share.
Nicole: You don’t have to share your whole life story. Even just showing a glimpse behind the scenes — I love seeing a “meet the team” type of thing. Obviously it can be a pain to update if you have a lot of turnover going in and out. But we were talking earlier about how in Stephanie’s email communication through ZenMaid, it says who your cleaner is going to be. Seeing their face, even in the email — the client is like, “Okay, this is who’s going to walk into my house.” They’re trusting you with their valuables, their safe space, their kids. I would want to know who the heck is coming into my house.
Stephanie: In our industry specifically, putting faces to your business is almost more important than in any other business I can think of. We talked a lot at CleanCon about the trust economy. This business is so about trust and seeing people. And you may think, “But I’m not going to be the one in the field — why would I put myself out there?” I’m not in the field, guys. I’m not even in the same state. But I’m still the face of my company. I still have my story that I can talk about, and they will trust you. If they like you and trust you, then they will trust that you’re hiring well.
Nicole: It’s all this chain of trust.
What’s Surprised Nicole About the Cleaning Industry
Stephanie: Is there anything that surprised you or maybe delighted you about working with cleaning business owners?
Nicole: I just think it’s a very personal industry, which I love. Everyone I’ve met and talked to — whether internally at ZenMaid, where we have a lot of employees who are also owners, part-time owners, co-owners, or people talking in the community — everyone is so nice. For the most part, you’re cleaning because you care about other people. In the world of a lot of my friends and peers on LinkedIn, it’s just very inauthentic and performative. I love the blue-collar versus white-collar dynamic here.
I was also really surprised in a good way — I can relate to cleaning and having cleaners. I’ve never had a cleaning service myself, but I see them all the time. The branded cars, people going in and out of homes. It’s been really gratifying to think, “I’m helping people who are helping people.” Once I started working with ZenMaid and talking to everybody, especially in the marketing department, they see my life and they’re like, “Maybe I should do that.” And it’s like, no. Most people are not at that stage. And even a couple of years ago it was a totally different thing.
Comparison Culture and Feeling Behind
Stephanie: I’m sure you guys can relate to this — you see somebody far ahead of you. Big company, seems so glamorous. But they had to go through the hard stuff too.
Nicole: Everyone always feels like they’re behind in some way. It could be career, it could be relationships — “This person has this title, they’re a manager, but I’m still not a manager. I should be, because we’re the same age, we graduated at the same time.” It’s just so easy to always be comparing yourself to other people.
In my career too — when I first started my first job out of college, super entry level, one of my college friends went to Microsoft and was making $90,000 a year at the entry level. I was like, “Why?” We compare a lot on the timeline.
Stephanie: It’s funny because I literally was doing that yesterday. I was talking to Holly Moore — who is a queen — she’s at ten million plus a year with Maids and Moore down in Texas. She’s one of the organizers of CleanCon. And I was literally like, “Okay, but how long did it take you to hit five million? When did you start?” And I started doing the math. I felt that so much this weekend — “I’m behind, I’m behind” — seeing people ahead of me, thinking, “But how long did it take them?” And I could see all of us doing it to each other, because we’re all asking questions about timeline. Or some of you coming up to me like, “I’ve been doing this for fifteen years. How did you do this so fast?” It’s really interesting how comparison is built into our psyche.
Nicole: Social media absolutely exacerbates that — you’re just seeing the best of people. When I went to college, I remember it really stressed me out because I was like, “Okay, everybody else adjusted just fine. I’m here missing my family, feeling like I don’t have friends yet.” And these people are like, “I’ve been in college for a week and these are my best friends.” I’m like, “How do you make best friends in a week? I haven’t figured out the dining hall yet.”
Stephanie: Even think about something as simple as interior design. I love my house to be beautiful. I would never have been able to see a stranger’s living room before, like, ten years ago — unless it was in a magazine. Now I’m on Pinterest for inspiration. When I do a bathroom project, I post it on Facebook. The ability to even know what’s going on in strangers’ lives — that just never existed before. And it has caused a lot of undue stress of, “Am I there? Am I there?” Social media absolutely exacerbates that. Sometimes I just want to throw my phone into the abyss. But I’m also really nosy and I want to know what everyone is up to.
Nicole: You should open a cleaning business. I rescind my earlier statement — because as a nosy person, I love being in people’s houses. I’m here for the tea. I’m here for the drama, as long as it involves me.
Stephanie: I’m like, “Oh, they’re getting a divorce?” But that’s not funny — that’s a sad thing.
Nicole: We’re not laughing at it. We’re laughing with it.
Stephanie: This is why we can’t keep it together.
Avoiding the Comparison Trap
Stephanie: Tying it all back — it’s very easy to feel like, when you’re looking at other businesses and seeing their congratulatory anniversary posts, that you’re not doing well enough. Sometimes doing your best is all you can give in a day. It’s really easy to compare yourself to everybody else — other owners, your neighbors. I really try — even with that example I gave about how I was feeling this weekend — I’m trying to walk away from this experience thinking, “Learn from them. Don’t compare yourself to them.” And for you guys who are doing that even to me — learn from me, don’t compare. We’re on totally different races here. You’re going against yourself.
Wrapping Up
Stephanie: This has been amazing, Nicole. I’m so glad we were able to be together. It was a fantastic weekend.
Nicole: It’s been a week. We need to get to the airport.
Stephanie: We do have to go home. But yeah, we wanted to come talk about content and stuff. Nicole can’t offer any advice about owning a cleaning business — you probably don’t want whatever advice she has because it’s not going to be very useful — but she does know a lot about content and marketing. This is like my twin flame. We shared a hotel room, so we’re like buddies now. She stayed at my house a month ago, so it’s all good.
Leave Nicole some love in the comments, guys. If you love the newsletters, she is the writer of the newsletters — and Amar technically, but we collaborate, he knows. A lot of the ZenMaid stuff is her. Come say hey. We also love to hear feedback about what people want to see more of. If you’re watching this and also see ZenMaid stuff and you’re like, “I really want to learn more about this or that,” or “I want more funny content, more memes, more bloopers” — let us know.
Nicole: I don’t want to see my pants, so just a little suggestion box.
Stephanie: All right, hit that like, hit that subscribe, leave a comment. We gotta go to the airport. See you in the next episode. Peace, cleaners!
Resources Mentioned in This Episode
- ZenMaid
- ZenMaid Mastermind
- Watch Drew Larison’s episode on Filthy Rich Cleaners — E106: Drew Larison’s Take on Google vs. Facebook Ads for Cleaners
- CleanCon
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